How rude is this?!

[Clare H]

Sorry, but does anyone know how rude/vulgar the expression 'fils de chien' is? I'm not sure where to place it in comparison to similar Eng expressions these days...

Merci!

Clare

[Erwan]

I've not read this expression for a long time. I think this expression is/was more often used by arab people speaking French (but it's just perhaps a cliché).

It's an insult meaning something like "son of a bitch". I read on wikipedia it can be translated in "hundason" (is it right?)

[Clare H]

Hi Erwan, thanks for the reply. I looked at the link on Hundason, as I've never come across that, but I have to say I've never heard it used in English. What I'm really wondering is that when you use 'son of a bitch' as an insult in Eng, especially in writing, it is quite shocking still (unless it is used jokingly, which is possible too) - does 'fils d'un chien' have the same effect do you think or is it less shocking/insulting?

Merci bien!

Clare

[Erwan]

I see it as something really insulting.

But I read an article where someone related an anecdote about her father. Her grandmother called him fils de chien but in a friendly way. Yet she thought it was a nasty insult.

I don't think it is usual but it could happen.

[Clare H]

Hmm, yeah, and looking around a bit more on the internet I agree with you, it seems to be as insulting as son of a bitch usually is. The context I read it in is insulting, but wasn't sure whether to go so strong in English translation - but I think I will have to! (It's from a novel by the way)

Merci!

[lauris]

I would say that "fils de chien" is a little less rude than "fils de pute" (the translation of 'son of a bitch'). Simply because the very words of "fils de pute" are already rude.

But, when I hear "fils de chien" said in a serious way, it is more hateful than "fils de pute" which is "just" insulting.

[Clare H]

Thanks Lauris. I willl go for a strong option in English. Translating swear words etc is always tricky, getting the level/tone etc right! Thanks for the help.

Clare

[Neil Coffey]

I don't translate much fiction/films myself-- tends to be more "businessy" stuff-- but one thing I have noticed in various film translations is that there is a tendency for translators, possibly deliberately, to "tone down" the translations of expletives.

 

I've noticed it a few times that a word that is overtly vulgar/expletive in the source language becomes a more mild slang word in the translation (you can sometimes see this in foreign film screenings in cinemas when a few native speakers of the source language are giggling their heads off while the rest of the audience is sitting there bewildered as to what the big joke was).

[Clare H]

Yes, in literary translation (novels as well as films) there is a definite tendancy to tone down vulgarity, as well as to standardise many other marked features of the source language so that it becomes more 'acceptable' to the target language reader/viewer. It's one of the biggest dilemmas of literary translation to my mind! Maybe one reason translated fiction is not popular...???

[Brandon Soler]

 

 

Well I've never heard it used in a sentence before, but it means son of a dog..though to be closer to english I think it would be fils de chienne meaning son of a bitch/female dog.

 

I'm sure there are much worse insults, I know a couple but won't put them here in case of sensitive eyes.

 

I'm far from an expert here, but Lauris - I think Fils de Pute  translates more accurately to 'Son of a Whore', same as Putana in italian which historically created the name for the pasta sauce 'Putanesca' :).

 

Needless to say, it's not flattering.

 

 

EDIT: Sorry Lauris, I misread your post earlier, totally agree with you!